J&S Safeguard, Individual Cylinder Knock Control System - Lightning Forum

Rob_03Cobra · 02-23-2008, 05:02 PM

I'm happy to bring this one up from the dead because John @ J&S does now have something for the Lightning's. Me and John have become on line buddies over time and I've been following his L Knock Controller Set Up quite a while now on other Forums. AMOF he's been looking for a Lightning to test it on and I'm not sure if he found one yet ??? I didnt realize our old Buddy Jody mentioned John and J&S until I just re-read this post.

John joined the site and also became a Site Supporter hopefully he'll stop in and explain more about it.
I believe this is our set up here

John @ J&S · 02-23-2008, 07:29 PM

Hi, this is John.

As far as I know, Jody hasn't used our system, but he is interested in one we will be releasing shortly. We announce a version for Ford COPs in mid '07, and I see that he no longer has his L. Looks like his latest project will be using a BigStuff system with GM coils. I emailed him that I was working on a system for that set up.

I started a thread on another forum, asking for a "test ride" in a SoCal Lightning, to evaluate the engine noise coming from the knock sensor.

The "test ride" will require a temporary install of our system, then make a few mild 60 mph to 80 mph passes on the freeway. The system can only retard, so these passes will be even safer than running without the unit.

To install, no wires are cut, though eight control wires from the unit must be connected to the coils. Also, 12v and ground, and a knock signal.

The connections to the coil signals are made with wire splices, and a tube of silicone jelly is included in the kit to prevent corrosion. See attached photo.

We have knock sensor adapter bolts that replace a motor mount bolt, making it easy to mount a sensor. If we have time to play, we may try to find the stock sensor cable and look at that signal as well.

If anyone in SoCal is willing to participate, we will extend dealer pricing if you decide to order within one year.

Please contact me if you can participate in the test.

John Pizzuto
J&S Electronics
714 534-6975
jpizzuto@jandssafeguard.com

Bgstew6 · 02-23-2008, 10:04 PM

hmmmmmmmmmmm

Im from socal....OCeanside to be exact......

Rob_03Cobra · 02-24-2008, 08:21 AM

WELCOME JOHN

:

PS I fixed my post

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob_00Lightning

I didnt realize our old Buddy Jody mentioned John and J&S until I just re-read this post.

Dbl G · 02-25-2008, 10:44 PM

This would be a long over due improvement (Hello Ford) for our engines. Stew ( http://www.lightningrodder.com/forum/member.php?u=523) is and has been a very reliable Guinea Pig for me over the years...

Pitstain · 02-26-2008, 12:47 AM

Hey John,

Nice to see you over here, I am seriously interested in seeign the testing data of this system on the Lightning, and I think this would be an excellent saftey net for when I run open track events.

Keep us updated.

Bgstew6 · 03-02-2008, 12:25 AM

IT began today....

Great meeting John and his wife! first off.....Great Peoples gents and was an honor to get to work with John and assist him as well as lend my Truck as his test mule for his system.

WE spent a couple hours installing hardware and Test Gear....Looking promising folks...just not soup yet. Hopefully John walked away today with some good data from todays efforts......

Although there were not many 60-80mph runs..LOL....

Just a few 70-120mph runs RONFLMAO...

looking forward to Round #2 of testing!!!

Dbl G · 03-02-2008, 06:52 AM

Lets hope it works, if it were that simple one would think Ford would have corrected the problem with ours and hooked them up.
Hopefull..

JJ@WMS · 03-02-2008, 08:34 AM

I have been waiting for a test mule myself.

John was nice enough to have one of his customers local to me contact me and give me a unit for testing but I am still waiting on customer to offer up their truck.

It is a very promising unit and in theory it should allow the motor to run safer total spark timing, however I must say that the one reason why I am having a hard time finding a truck to use it on is the difficulty of not only the install but the setup of the unit.

The unit cant be used under the hood, so you have to run the wires thru the firewall and then set it up using the sensitivity dial and so forth. I really wish the unit was plug and play without having to go thru the setup part, it would appeal to more people if it were.

Also, the fear that most have is what if the unit pulls timing when it shouldnt? What if it hears something that it thinks is knock and pulls timing thereby killing power?

We already set the max allowed timing in the tunes so what would happen if we allowed more spark and let the unit do its job but the unit failed somehow?

John is a really nice guy, and the product is top notch so please dont take any of what I am saying negative, its just concerns and questions that I have or have been presented to me. From a safety standpoint its a great idea/unit, but IMHO I'm not sure that its a benefit from a performance enhancing standpoint.

JJ@WMS

Bgstew6 · 03-02-2008, 10:38 AM

Install was not hard at all...........................

The setting up of the system I dont see as hard either............

SUX2BU · 03-02-2008, 11:15 AM

Sounds like this would benefit those fellas who are pushing the limits with a stock bottom end....if what JJ is saying happens well then it wouldn't be so much a problem because like the saying goes, "its better to be safe than sorry." On the other hand those fellas who are built....well, what would be the purpose? Pushing the limits on a motor that was built to take the abuse....this is when losing timing would become an issue. Just my .02

Bgstew6 · 03-02-2008, 11:50 AM

For things you cant control........that cause detonation......that dont have a safety mech to retard timing.....this would be it....built or Stock.

Rob_03Cobra · 03-02-2008, 11:53 AM

I've also been following this product a while now and have become on line friends with John. I warned him how Ford was never able to make the knock sensor work on the L, but he already does have it working on other SC Fords so I am def hopeful they can figure it out.

My concern would be exactly what JJ mentioned but if that can be worked out (where it doesnt pull timing when it doesnt have to) the rewards would be life saving. (Stock Block OR BUILT there are prob a hundred motors a year that could be saved)

There are ALOT of built and stock motors that blow because of a simple failure; clogged injector (I know people who lost very expensive built L motors due to that), a bad fuel filter, (almost took out my stock motor, it did melt 3 plugs and when the motor came apart I was amazed on how much detonation damage it caused), a fuel pump relay, (thats prob happen to too many to count), bad fuel pump, or simple a bad tune (been there done that too).

Point being if something was able to protect us better when something went wrong (which prob makes up 80%+ of engine failures) it truly would be PRICELESS....

Glad to see you helping John out Stew, keep us up to date on the progress

:

JJ@WMS · 03-02-2008, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bgstew6

For things you cant control........that cause detonation......that dont have a safety mech to retard timing.....this would be it....built or Stock.

I agree.

James@RWTD did some testing with the unit on a Cobra, let me see if I can find that information.

JJ@WMS

britincali · 03-02-2008, 06:44 PM

I dont see how they cant get the knock sesors to work with our motors when the Jag has the exact same blower with no issues.

02-23-2008, 05:02 PM	#1
Rob_03Cobra Founder/Owner Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Selden, NY Posts: 6,906 Rep Power: 71583090	J&S Safeguard, Individual Cylinder Knock Control System I'm happy to bring this one up from the dead because John @ J&S does now have something for the Lightning's. Me and John have become on line buddies over time and I've been following his L Knock Controller Set Up quite a while now on other Forums. AMOF he's been looking for a Lightning to test it on and I'm not sure if he found one yet ??? I didnt realize our old Buddy Jody mentioned John and J&S until I just re-read this post. John joined the site and also became a Site Supporter hopefully he'll stop in and explain more about it. I believe this is our set up here __________________ *** COBRA, "THE OTHER WHITE MEAT" * 03 Cobra, Built Motor, KB 2.8H, PA 4r70w, PI 3500 Triple Disc Lockup Conv PI Manual Valve Body, Transbrake, 8.8 SRA Rear, 3.73 Gears, Eaton Posi, Moser 31 Spline Axles, AND A LOT MORE... Details Here -- Fun Vid Here Black 02 Sold 6/6/6 - Red 99 Sold 2/2/7 - Black 00 Sold 12/29/9 -** Last edited by Rob_03Cobra; 02-24-2008 at 08:23 AM.

02-23-2008, 10:04 PM	#3
Bgstew6 Blown Twice.... Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 15,601 Rep Power: 65394543	hmmmmmmmmmmm Im from socal....OCeanside to be exact...... __________________ 2k2 Black Harley Davidson SCrew, #1088 21lbs of Pure, Cogged, Magnum Power's Screamin Hell! "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle." - Sun Tzu My Gallery How come these injuns ain't killin us??? Cause they can't see us, we're in the spirit world asshole!!!

03-02-2008, 12:25 AM	#7
Bgstew6 Blown Twice.... Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 15,601 Rep Power: 65394543	IT began today.... Great meeting John and his wife! first off.....Great Peoples gents and was an honor to get to work with John and assist him as well as lend my Truck as his test mule for his system. WE spent a couple hours installing hardware and Test Gear....Looking promising folks...just not soup yet. Hopefully John walked away today with some good data from todays efforts...... Although there were not many 60-80mph runs..LOL.... Just a few 70-120mph runs RONFLMAO... looking forward to Round #2 of testing!!! __________________ 2k2 Black Harley Davidson SCrew, #1088 21lbs of Pure, Cogged, Magnum Power's Screamin Hell! "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle." - Sun Tzu My Gallery How come these injuns ain't killin us??? Cause they can't see us, we're in the spirit world asshole!!!

03-02-2008, 08:34 AM	#9
JJ@WMS Supporting Vendor Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,878 Rep Power: 21173097	I have been waiting for a test mule myself. John was nice enough to have one of his customers local to me contact me and give me a unit for testing but I am still waiting on customer to offer up their truck. It is a very promising unit and in theory it should allow the motor to run safer total spark timing, however I must say that the one reason why I am having a hard time finding a truck to use it on is the difficulty of not only the install but the setup of the unit. The unit cant be used under the hood, so you have to run the wires thru the firewall and then set it up using the sensitivity dial and so forth. I really wish the unit was plug and play without having to go thru the setup part, it would appeal to more people if it were. Also, the fear that most have is what if the unit pulls timing when it shouldnt? What if it hears something that it thinks is knock and pulls timing thereby killing power? We already set the max allowed timing in the tunes so what would happen if we allowed more spark and let the unit do its job but the unit failed somehow? John is a really nice guy, and the product is top notch so please dont take any of what I am saying negative, its just concerns and questions that I have or have been presented to me. From a safety standpoint its a great idea/unit, but IMHO I'm not sure that its a benefit from a performance enhancing standpoint. JJ@WMS __________________ FOR GREAT PARTS AND TUNING AT GREAT PRICES ALONG WITH SUPERIOR CUSTOMER SERVICE CALL OR EMAIL ME DIRECT jjssvt@aol.com Order Line 443-340-4375 Custom Dyno Tuning and parts installation for Ford GM and Chrysler in Maryland "As long as you carry anger in your heart about the past, it'll keep you from enjoying your present & future." Rev. Run

03-02-2008, 10:38 AM	#10
Bgstew6 Blown Twice.... Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 15,601 Rep Power: 65394543	Install was not hard at all........................... The setting up of the system I dont see as hard either............ __________________ 2k2 Black Harley Davidson SCrew, #1088 21lbs of Pure, Cogged, Magnum Power's Screamin Hell! "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle." - Sun Tzu My Gallery How come these injuns ain't killin us??? Cause they can't see us, we're in the spirit world asshole!!! Last edited by Bgstew6; 03-02-2008 at 11:01 AM.

02-25-2008, 10:44 PM	#5
Dbl G SV / Pending Renewal Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Metro Atlanta Posts: 9,780 Rep Power: 0	This would be a long over due improvement (Hello Ford) for our engines. Stew ( http://www.lightningrodder.com/forum/member.php?u=523) is and has been a very reliable Guinea Pig for me over the years...

03-02-2008, 06:52 AM	#8
Dbl G SV / Pending Renewal Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Metro Atlanta Posts: 9,780 Rep Power: 0	Lets hope it works, if it were that simple one would think Ford would have corrected the problem with ours and hooked them up. Hopefull..

03-02-2008, 11:15 AM	#11
SUX2BU Enlarged Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Alvin, Texas Posts: 1,869 Rep Power: 7158526	Sounds like this would benefit those fellas who are pushing the limits with a stock bottom end....if what JJ is saying happens well then it wouldn't be so much a problem because like the saying goes, "its better to be safe than sorry." On the other hand those fellas who are built....well, what would be the purpose? Pushing the limits on a motor that was built to take the abuse....this is when losing timing would become an issue. Just my .02 __________________ 2000 Ford Lightning (Silver) 2002 Ford Harley Davidson (DSG) 1995 Ford Lightning (White)

03-02-2008, 11:50 AM	#12
Bgstew6 Blown Twice.... Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 15,601 Rep Power: 65394543	For things you cant control........that cause detonation......that dont have a safety mech to retard timing.....this would be it....built or Stock. __________________ 2k2 Black Harley Davidson SCrew, #1088 21lbs of Pure, Cogged, Magnum Power's Screamin Hell! "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle." - Sun Tzu My Gallery How come these injuns ain't killin us??? Cause they can't see us, we're in the spirit world asshole!!!

03-02-2008, 11:53 AM	#13
Rob_03Cobra Founder/Owner Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Selden, NY Posts: 6,906 Rep Power: 71583090	I've also been following this product a while now and have become on line friends with John. I warned him how Ford was never able to make the knock sensor work on the L, but he already does have it working on other SC Fords so I am def hopeful they can figure it out. My concern would be exactly what JJ mentioned but if that can be worked out (where it doesnt pull timing when it doesnt have to) the rewards would be life saving. (Stock Block OR BUILT there are prob a hundred motors a year that could be saved) There are ALOT of built and stock motors that blow because of a simple failure; clogged injector (I know people who lost very expensive built L motors due to that), a bad fuel filter, (almost took out my stock motor, it did melt 3 plugs and when the motor came apart I was amazed on how much detonation damage it caused), a fuel pump relay, (thats prob happen to too many to count), bad fuel pump, or simple a bad tune (been there done that too). Point being if something was able to protect us better when something went wrong (which prob makes up 80%+ of engine failures) it truly would be PRICELESS.... Glad to see you helping John out Stew, keep us up to date on the progress :

03-02-2008, 06:44 PM	#15
britincali Goats r sheep with handlebars! Join Date: May 2007 Location: Barstow, CA Posts: 1,853 Rep Power: 10651524	I dont see how they cant get the knock sesors to work with our motors when the Jag has the exact same blower with no issues. __________________ 2002 F150 harley DSG 4lb lower,2.9 upper, Steig Stg 4, C&L plenum, FTVB, K+N FIPK, Bassani hi flow mids ,Bassani catback, X-pipe,TR-6,JLP Longbars, Dynojet WBC, LFP idler.

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